[Nordskogen] Accessible Helpful Support was demos -

[Michael Nunn-Weinberg]

Greetings all,

I would like to preface this by saying that Giovanna does not need me to speak for her,
and in fact I agree with some of the issues that Gwen and others have raised. My wife and
I moved here over 5 years ago from Ealdormere and have seen both the good and the bad. 

However, I would like to remind people of the first few paragraphs of the the post that 
started all of this:

>From Giovanna:

"After the Caponi demo last year I started thinking that perhaps having some general guidelines for demos would be a good thing.  I spoke to several people who agreed that it was a good thing, so I am sharing my ideas with the Barony and Cantons.
   
Please note that these are MY thoughts on the subject of demos and should not be viewed as opinions by the organizer of the Caponi demo, the Barony, or the SCA in general

What is our Goal?  I feel our goal is 2-fold: one is to provide a group of individuals demonstrating period activities to add color to a Shakespeare weekend and the other is to inform the public of the SCA's existence to provide legitimacy to our organization and also to attract possible new members.
   
How to meet these goals/ how do we present ourselves?
It is my opinion that the Caponi demo provides Nordskogen with the chance to present ourselves as a professional organization. With this in mind I feel that each participant should take it upon themselves to be the best representative of what the SCA has to offer by doing the following:.... "

I don't think she could have made it any clearer that these are just her opinions. If some people choose to feel that because she is a Laurel, anything she says is intended as a command or decree, she cannot be held responsible for that.

This thread has been used to start a discussion on how newcomers to the SCA or active members who have 
moved here from other Kingdoms have been treated by the established locals. This has the makings of a nasty, yet to be perfectly honest, necessary discussion that would be best moved to a thread of its' own.

Regards,
Zadok ben Solomon ibn Alfakhar


> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Gwen Trevirensis" <gwen.trevirensis at gmail.com>
> To: "The Hall of Nordskogen" <nordskogen at nordskogen.northshield.org>
> Subject: Re: [Nordskogen] Accessible Helpful Support was demos -
> Date: Wed, 19 Jul 2006 08:47:04 -0500
> 
> 
> Yes, Giovanna's post should have been prefaced by "in my opinion" because it
> came across that it was a decree.  I have met some really nice people here,
> but I have to say I have run into some of the nastiest people I have ever
> run into in the SCA here as well....and that's 20 years folks.  So maybe
> instead of worrying about becoming better on the outside, some of the people
> in this Barony need to work on becoming better on the inside.  No amount of
> expensive fabric is going to make a nasty person look good or make a good
> impression.
> Victory is fleeting.  Just remember that a title CAN be taken away, just as
> easily as it is gained.  A certain baron in Bright Hills lost his title
> because of his behaviour.
> 
> Gwen
> 
> On 7/18/06, A. B. <nasionnaich at hotmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >
> >    I  have  been  keeping  up  on the doings of the Barony and the SCA in
> >    general,  even  though  I have not attended any meetings or events for
> >    quite  some  time. I have been following this "discussion", and I feel
> >    that  it  is time I speak out on this subject. I am going to be blunt,
> >    and I make no apologies for doing so. If you don't want to "hear" what
> >    I have to say, just hit the "delete" button right now and you will not
> >    have to worry about being offended.
> >
> >    Thank you Devin (Brenda) and Iriye (Elizabeth), for stating what I was
> >    trying  to  say  to  people last year (and it seemed to fall on mostly
> >    deaf  ears  then). Not everyone has oodles of money available to spend
> >    on  the  SCA.  Not  everyone has oodles of time to do SCA things. Some
> >    people  have enough trouble just getting by while indulging their need
> >    for  interests outside of the home. Those who do have lots of time and
> >    money,  good  for  you  --  but  PLEASE do not expect everyone else to
> >    participate  and  or be as authentic at all times as yourselves. There
> >    really  are people who truly wish to be a part of the SCA, yet are not
> >    able to shine nearly as brightly as those in the "Inner Circle".
> >
> >    I was helping to set up a Court one night at a weekily meeting (it was
> >    a  Folkmoot  night), when one of the "Royalty" snapped that she wasn't
> >    helpless,  goddammit,  she  could do things for herself. I was made to
> >    feel,  whether  intentionally  or  not, that my help was very much NOT
> >    welcome.  Things  like  this do not make people want to volunteer very
> >    much  at  all,  because what's the point of volunteering when you will
> >    not be thanked for it anyway.
> >
> >    And  when  ANYONE  in  ANY  position  of  Authority  even implies that
> >    something  just  has to be done "this way and not that way", it really
> >    DOES  come  across  as  being  a "Royal Decree". Even when the implied
> >    "decree"  is just a suggestion. Those of you who are in such positions
> >    of  Authority  should wait  before hitting that "send" button and read
> >    what  you  have written, just to see if there is any possible way your
> >    message can be misunderstood -- no matter how good your intentions may
> >    be. I hope we all know what the road to H*** is paved with.
> >
> >    Hopefully,  now some people will see at least one of the reasons why I
> >    decided  to  take  some time away from active participation in the SCA
> >    and  leave  all of the petty bickering and politics which seem to have
> >    become  such  an  integral part of the SCA. Real Life -- "Mundania" --
> >    should  have more than enough politics for everyone. And by "politics"
> >    I  mean the practice (whether conciously or subconciously) of snubbing
> >    others because their "kit" isn't "good enough" or other such things.
> >    ---Artúr Dúbh Mac a'Gobhaínn
> >        ______________________________________________________________
> >
> >      From: "Elizabeth Chase" <elizabethlchase at msn.com>
> >      Reply-To: The Hall of Nordskogen
> >      <nordskogen at nordskogen.northshield.org>
> >      To: "The Hall of Nordskogen"
> >      <nordskogen at nordskogen.northshield.org>
> >      Subject: [Nordskogen] Accessible Helpful Support was demos -
> >      Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2006 02:42:59 -0500
> >      I  have  a  suggestion...... how about changing this thread to 'how
> >      helpful can we be'? Attempts like this at some kind of
> >      mediation  make me grind me teeth. I agree that in substance, there
> >      was no 'decree of authenticity' concretely stated..... however,
> >      as  in  all forms of communication, the effect on the recipients is
> >      what is important.... if they feel that the decree is there, then
> >      it is implied.
> >      snip............snip
> >
> >      .
> >      Leaders, intentionally or not, defacto or implied, set the example.
> >      We need to quit telling other people what fish to eat and start
> >      teaching  them  how  to  fish for themselves. Individually, hand to
> >      hand..... They will teach someone else how to fish......
> >      ... or so the story goes......
> >      Anyway, one more stir of the spoon......
> >      Iriye
> >      (who is secretly hoping to just get folks thinking)
> > _______________________________________________
> > Nordskogen mailing list
> > Nordskogen at nordskogen.northshield.org
> > http://mailman.nordskogen.northshield.org/listinfo/nordskogen
> >
> _______________________________________________
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> Nordskogen at nordskogen.northshield.org
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>


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